Phil catches up with friend-of-the-show Esau McCaulley (New Testament Professor, NYT columnist, author of CT Book of the Year Reading While Black) for a wide-ranging conversation. Why do we keep getting MLK wrong? What do Black voices give up in order to be invited into white spaces, and is there a better way? What does McCaulley do to refocus on Jesus? And why did he decide his new book should be about, of all things, Lent??

McCaulley is a deep thinker AND a little bit of a goofball. Which makes his conversations with Phil always worth your time.

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0:46 - Intro

2:36 - Esau McCaulley interview

5:43 Martin Luther King Jr.

21:43 Systemic racism

28:01 Black voices in white spaces

41:50 Lent

45:58 End Credits

Links mentioned

The Kind of Revolution That Martin Luther King Jr. Envisioned by Esau McCaulley

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/01/15/opinion/martin-luther-king-woke-reparations.html

@esaumccaulley

Esaumccaulley.com

Lent: The Season of Repentance and Renewal (Fullness of Time, 1) by Esau McCaulley https://amzn.to/3WXNodo

Reading While Black by Esau McCaulley https://amzn.to/3Rzw1ys

Josey Johnson's Hair and the Holy Spirit by Esau McCaulley https://amzn.to/3HUgndE

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