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In this episode, I speak with Matthieu Pageau, author of The Language of Creation. This is a rare (and almost unbelievable) interview. With a high degree of likelihood, I can say that this interview, if watched all the way until the end, will change your life. Pageau argues that Satan is first a function—the tester and accuser—before a villain. Think Job’s auditor or a hired penetration tester. When will-to-power takes over, the function falls. He lays out a symbolic grammar: heaven as plan, earth as materials. Water renews. The feminine crowns and renovates forms. Abraham and Moses act as faithful adversaries. Adam and Eve show what secrecy breaks. Borderline stories like Tamar and Ruth trace exile and redemption. Pageau speaks from his own exile, leaning Orthodox/Catholic, critiquing without grasping for power, and letting reality correct him.
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Listen on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/4gL14b92xAErofYQA7bU4e
Timestamps:
- 00:00 - Who Are You? (Identity as Relational vs. Self-Defined)
- 04:54 - How Matthieu’s Project Differs From His Brother’s (Jonathan Pageau)
- 10:25 - The God-Created Function of Satan vs. The Fallen Entity
- 18:34 - Are Internal Critics “Functional Satanists”?
- 23:02 - Satan in the Book of Job: The Divine Hacker
- 27:50 - The Axioms of Reality: A Computer Scientist’s Worldview
- 32:08 - Heaven as “The Plan,” Earth as “The Materials”
- 36:50 - The Dual Nature of Chaos (Symbolism of Water)
- 44:08 - Why Are Women Central to the Resurrection Story?
- 49:14 - The Simple Act That Could Have Prevented “The Fall”
- 52:18 - Gödel’s Incompleteness Theorem as the ‘Feminine’ Crown
- 59:31 - Redeeming the Exiled: The Pattern of Ruth
- 1:05:00 - A Christian in Exile: Matthieu’s Spiritual Homelessness
- 1:16:15 - How to Escape Metaphysical Exile
- 1:21:44 - The Will to Power: When Criticism Becomes Corrupt
- 1:26:53 - The Paradox: Why You MUST Believe Yours is ‘The Real Church’
- 1:34:25 - What ‘Nature’ Truly Means
- 1:47:44 - Why Renewal, Updating, and Competition Are ‘Feminine’
- 1:55:10 - The Story of Tamar: Deception as Righteous Renewal
- 2:01:00 - How to Read the Bible Symbolically
- 2:09:51 - Why Symbolism Applies to Stories, Not Raw Data
- 2:21:34 - The ‘Dangerous’ Vision That Birthed The Book
- 2:31:31 - Mind vs. Spirit vs. Outlook (And The Final Paradox)
Links Mentioned:
- The Language Of Creation [Book]: https://www.amazon.com/Language-Creation-Symbolism-Genesis-Commentary/dp/1981549331/ref=tmm_pap_swatch_0
- Jonathan Pageau [TOE]: https://youtu.be/X3co_AA6yec
- Wolfgang Smith [TOE]: https://youtu.be/vp18_L_y_30
- Claudia de Rham [TOE]: https://youtu.be/Ve_Mpd6dGv8
- Leo Gura [TOE]: https://youtu.be/YspFR9JAq3w
- The Story Of The Fall: https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis%203&version=NIV
- The Most Abused Theorem In Math [TOE]: https://youtu.be/OH-ybecvuEo
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